Forum Replies Created
-
AuthorPosts
-
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorIn the first instance I would try using your existing genoa fairleads and jam cleats. That will not necessarily be ideal, but it will at least work after a fashion, and the set of the sail will then give you some idea in what direction you want to move. Then you can try the experimentation that I suggested previously.
If you are lucky, and it is by no means an impossibility, you may even find that they work fine. If the luff is the same length as that of a genoa, and the leech and the foot happen to be in the same proportions as those of a genoa, you will probably find that the existing position is indeed about right.
One thing you do not want to do, in the course of experimenting, is to drill holes in the deck until you are very sure that they are in the right place!
Oliver
-
This reply was modified 7 years, 4 months ago by
Oliver Shaw.
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorI thought at first you were using the word “cleats” in the American sense, to mean what we call fairleads; but I then spotted that you also ask whether the sheets should run through the genoa fairleads, so you are making a distinction between the two. So far as the set of the sail is concerned, what matters is the position of the fairleads, not the jam cleats, and it is perfectly possible to sail without jam cleats – particularly if you are using only a jib, rather than a genoa.
So position the fairleads for correct setting of the sail (see below).
Then position the jam cleats so that they are convenient and reliable in use; you can easily get the sheet into the jammer, while sitting out, and (absolutely vital) you can instantly release it from the jammer on demand.
That apart, your question depends on what precisely you mean by a jib; i.e. it depends on the dimensions and the cut of your sail.
The original design sailplan was mainsail and jib, and the jib (in that sense) is still specified in the Class Rules and therefore has very specific (maximum) dimensions. It is almost unheard of for a sailmaker to make the jib significantly smaller than the maximum permitted dimensions, so a sail would normally be made as close as reasonably possible to the maximum dimensions, but just very slightly below the maximum in order to allow a working tolerance.
However your previous post refers to “some jibs being longer or shorter than others”, i.e. what you have may or may not be an official GP14 jib. Unless you intend racing in CVDRA events that will be entirely academic so far as Class Rules are concerned, since it will not exceed the permitted size of the genoa, but it may affect where you require your fairleads to be.
A further complication is the emergence in recent years of the unofficial midi sail; this is not specified in the Class Rules, so dimensions and cut are not standardised, but the size falls somewhere between the official jib and the genoa, and my understanding is that for this sail it is usually recommended that it has its own set of fairleads mounted further inboard than the genoa fairleads.
Since there is some uncertainty about your sail the best approach is probably experimentation. Hoist the sail, with the halliard properly taut, with the boat ashore and on her trailer, on an occasion when there is a good sailing wind blowing; anything from force 2 to force 3, possibly even force 4. Align the boat 45 degrees to the wind, as though sailing close-hauled (i.e. on a beat). Now lead the sheet down to the deck by hand and see where it needs to come to in order for the sail to set well.
When you think you have the answer, also hoist the main and sheet it in – and if it is blowing force 4 you may need some assistance, to prevent the boat from tipping over. Now check the jib sheeting position again, to ensure that it does not backwind the main, that you have a good curve, and an open slot.
If it helps, the original design, which you remember set the official jib, had fixed fairleads; these were mounted amidships, more or less in line with the centre of the thwart, and at the outboard edge of the deck. Some limited control of sheeting angle could be achieved by mounting the tack of the jib on a strop if necessary.
Hope this helps,
Oliver
-
This reply was modified 7 years, 4 months ago by
Oliver Shaw.
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorCentreboard problems; see my paper on this in the Member Area on this site.
It may not give all the answers, but I think it is a useful start.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorGilles,
Excellent. You are warmly welcome.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorExcellent. I am very glad that we have been able to assist, and I wish you every enjoyment of your boat after all your hard work. She looks good in the photo.
On a separate issue, when I spoke to Julie in the office I gathered that you had applied for temporary membership of the Association. Now that the immediate problem has been resolved, could I ask you to please now consider standard membership, on a more permanent basis, if you have not already done so.
The Association is the primary body to support your use and ownership of your boat, but to be able to continue to do that most effectively we need the “clout” and authority of a reasonably large membership base, and to support our activities we also need membership subscriptions. (And I think, although I am open to correction, that as an “overseas” member your subscription is set at a much lower level than UK members.)
In return, as well as contributing towards the support of your class of boat you get – at least – the support of the whole Association, access to technical expertise, an excellent Members’ magazine twice per year, and the camaraderie of the Association.
If and when geography permits, which I appreciate will be less often for you than for UK members, you also have the opportunity to participate in a wide range of events; these include racing at all levels from absolutely top flight down to club events, cruising events, and vintage boat events. If you are ever able to participate in such events you will be very warmly welcome.
I hope that what we have been able to do for you so far may perhaps be an encouraging taster for membership of the Association on a more permanent basis.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorFor a simple, straight, tiller the cheapest way may well be to make one yourself, and it is easy enough to make. Dimensions are optional, but 4 feet seems a fairly popular choice of length. I have just measured up the slightly longer one of two which I have at home; that one is four feet, while the other is perhaps a couple of inches shorter.
However if you want a very nice laminated one, in alternate layers of pine and mahogany, and perhaps cranked as well, you could try Ben Dallimore, or alternatively Douglas Boatyard. http://boatsntillers.co.uk http://www.douglas-marine.co.uk
I attach two photos of the tiller which Ben Dallimore made for me a dozen years ago, for A Capella. I don’t have a photo of Douglas Boatyard’s work, but they are a general boatbuilder, and when I was visiting a few years ago and was in their chandlery I noticed and admired a nice laminated tiller which they had on the shelf. I casually asked whether it was one of Ben Dallimore’s, and was told no; it was one which they had made for a client, and he was about to collect it.
Hope this is helpful,
Oliver
Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.Oliver Shaw
ModeratorGilles,
Have you received this PDF file, and will it do the job for you?
Do please let us know how you get on with the French authorities.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorYour photos look good.
To address your queries:
Weather helm: first, distinguish between actual weather helm (i.e. how much rudder angle you need to apply to keep the boat straight) and the amount of pull on the tiller. The two are of course related, probably approximately proportional for small angles (and you should never have anything other than small angles), but they are not the same thing; as you have already picked up the relationship between them also depends on the profile of the rudder blade. The original design was for the blade to be swept back, as was normal at that time, but in the sixties the rules were changed to allow the blade to be set more or less vertical.
Changing the set of the blade is an easy modification, just cut away the appropriate amount of shoulder on the blade where it buts against the stock, and it will significantly reduce the pull on the tiller; what it won’t do is to cure an inherent weather problem, which you may well have.
Set the centreboard correctly first, then experiment with altering the trim of the boat, and then the mast rake. The centreboard should be fully down when beating to windward, always assuming that there is enough depth of water, and lass far down when sailing further off the wind. I think I read a report in Mainsail some years ago of an interview with Mike Senior, one of our Gold Fleet sailors and a multiple Championship winner, in which if I remember correctly he said that off the wind he likes to keep things simple and so sails with half plate for all off-wind legs; and since he is normally at the front of the top echelon racing fleet his techniques must be pretty good. I myself am not so high flying, so I like to adjust the plate progressively, having about half when I am on a beam reach or slightly broad on the beam, and about a quarter on a very broad reach or a run.
The boat should be sailed upright, and with the transom just clear of the water; so you need to ensure that you minimise heeling, and when working to windward (and with two persons aboard) the helmsman needs to be right up against the thwart, and the crew as far forward as is comfortable. Bring your weight slight further aft as you come off the wind, and in planing conditions you may need to come a long way aft. Many dinghy sailors who are not used to the GP14 have their weight too far aft all the time.
I am not sure what effect on helm balance having your weight too far aft will have, since it will move both the centre of lateral resistance and the centre of effort aft, but probably not by the same amount. What I am certain about is that having the transom dragging in the water will slow the boat down and make her much less efficient, and make the sailing harder work than it should be.
Allowing the boat to heel will of course introduce considerable weather helm.
If you are satisfied that your trim of the boat is correct, the next thing to experiment with is mast rake. Regard that 21′ 10″ dimension as only a starting point; that is a figure for the modern rig, with comparatively high rig tension and a bendy mast. It may be useful as a starting point, but now try adjusting the shrouds to allow the mast to come a little further forward. Keep experimenting until you have only very slight weather helm.
Hope this helps,
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorI have just spoken to Julie, in the Office, and when she replied to you earlier she was not entirely clear what help you wanted.
However she can advise that your boat was built by Fenn & Wood, in 1968. She will now send you a PDF file of the original measurement form, done by the builders.
I hope that this may be either exactly what you need to produce to the French authorities, or at least an acceptable substitute.
Hope this is helpful,
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorA canvas cuddy has the benefit that it can be folded down out of the way when not deployed.
The practical problems will include the very limited space, including the limitation posed by both the height of the boom and the presence of the kicker; you could manage without a kicker, particularly if you have (and use) a full width sheet horse, but it does limit your ability to sail safely on a dead run. But there are also benefits to having a cuddy, and the balance of drawbacks and benefits will depend in part on the type of sailing you intend to do.
Dare I ask the question; what do you want a cuddy for? And, related to that, would a good boom tent serve you equally well (or even better)? A boom tent cannot of course be used underway, but it can give more shelter than a cuddy when at anchor or mooring.
Oliver
-
This reply was modified 7 years, 5 months ago by
Oliver Shaw.
Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.Oliver Shaw
ModeratorAs a first step, join the Association and request a digital copy of our records.
That may well provide the information you need.
If it doesn’t, we may perhaps still be able to help in some way, depending on just what the French authorities require. I am unfamiliar with French legislation, but I would hope that as the world’s leading authority on the GP14 (and the copyright owner for the design) the Association might just possibly be able to negotiate with them to find a way round the difficulty. But I hope we don’t need to go there.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorI don’t know for certain, but I doubt that the number would have been assigned with a construction kit. Apart from the very earliest boats, where blocks of numbers were allocated to clubs who then assigned them to owners, I strongly aspect that numbers were not allocated until a member joined the Class Association.
In some instances that may have been during the build process, particularly for amateur built boats, and in that case I am not sure whether the number would be assigned as soon as requested (once the new member had joined the Association) or once the completed boat was officially measured.
The one personal detail that may just possibly shed some light on this is that in 1965 or ’66 I acquired a half share in boat no. 3239. She was amateur-built. For whatever reason we were under the impression that the boat did not have a class certificate, so she had to be officially measured at that point. There are some gaps in the argument here; I don’t know whether we asked the Association whether they held a measurement form for her – I was only just starting my involvement with the Association back then, and quite possibly didn’t know to ask the question! But if there was no measurement form for her extant, then it implies that the registration number had been issued at some time prior to the boat being measured.
Beyond that, so far as I personally am concerned, all is guesswork!
Oliver
-
This reply was modified 7 years, 5 months ago by
Oliver Shaw.
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorWater dribbling from the top of the centreboard case: I don’t reliably remember the construction on that model. Do you have a wooden capping piece, and is the water dribbling from underneath it?
If so, the capping is probably screwed in place; unscrew it, clean up, and refit, bedding it down onto a suitable sealant.
Silicone sealant will serve, but if you get any onto your varnish and fail to completely remove it before it cures you may then find it inordinately difficult to remove it later, and future varnish won’t adhere on top of it.
Better might be a polysulphide sealant, and they are available at about the same price as silicone sealants. Alternatively you could use something like CT1, which is a sealant adhesive, or HA6 which I have had recommended to me but which I have never used, or the appropriate grade of Sikaflex. https://www.marinescene.co.uk/view/4920/c.t.1-underwater-marine-sealant https://bond-it.co.uk/premier-range/ha6-rtv-silicone/
If the top of the case is bare GRP then it is a matter of identifying where the leak is, and then a standard GRP repair.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorYou could try the official Class Association policy, arranged with Craftinsure.
I at least have been very well served by them, and not only for my successive GP14s but for my trailer-sailer yacht as well. They are certainly my insurer of choice, and that is as a result of a business relationship built up over somewhere around ten years.
They understand the risks, and they understand sailing, helped in large measure by the fact that their senior Underwriter is a sailing man himself. So if you are reasonable and responsible and seamanlike, they well understand – and accept – the things that can occasionally go wrong if you slip up, or if someone else does so.
I have found them excellent when I have wanted extensions to my policies, for cruising. And their claims settlement is first class. We all hope never to have a claim, but it does occasionally happen. Over the course of ten years, with up to three boats simultaneously, I have had two theft claims (the last one being when my car was stolen, with a load of kit from the yacht inside) and one for a bent mast when several boats in our boat park blew over during an exceptional storm. In all three cases their settlement was prompt and courteous and efficient; and where I thought there were possibly slightly grey areas they were very concerned to ensure that I was fully recompensed.
They may not be the cheapest, but they are certainly good.
Oliver
Oliver Shaw
ModeratorThere were many builders, both professional and amateur.
Some of the headline names amongst the professionals of (I think) that period included: Bell Woodworking (of course), R. R. Sills (regarded by many as the Rolls Royce of GP14 builders), Moores of Wroxham, very probably Jack Holt, Fenn & Wood, (Bossom’s Boatyard, I think), and with a big question mark on date both Derek Jolley and Don Marine. However these latter two may possibly be too recent. And I am sure there are many others, who simply don’t immediately come to mind at this moment – although I feel sure that they should do!
And then there were any number of amateur builders, many of them working to very high standards; perhaps the majority of them built from Bell kits, but there were also some who chose to build from just the plans and the raw timber.
Oliver
-
This reply was modified 7 years, 4 months ago by
-
AuthorPosts



